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**Guest** · 09-08-2015, 10:51 AM

That is rough. Any actual hardware issues aside, another user Hunterjwizard solved many of his issues (random print fails/cancellations) by ditching XYZ's software and using Simplify3D instead. Seems XYX's software is pretty rough.

Simplify3D with XYZ Thread

**KillerTigger** · 09-08-2015, 12:40 PM

Yes, I already had a 1.0 so I knew just how crappy their software is. I started using S3D with my now-defunct 1.0a from day one - no comparison and the best tech support I've ever seen. Emailed them last night @ midnight about an issue with the new 3.4 Dreamer firmware and had a working solution from James @ S3D by 3 a.m.

**hunterjwizard** · 09-08-2015, 05:31 PM

I feel your pain, Killer, I feel it bad.

I am currently going back and forth trying to get them to replace an apparently defective extruder. If they aren't willing to send me a new one I think I may just buy a different printer.

**Guest** · 09-09-2015, 09:21 AM

So, another glowing review for Simplify3D and stay away from XYZ. I think all of use have plenty of experience with non-responsive customer service, and it really sucks. Can't get anything done and the hardware you paid good money for is worthless. As Hunternwizard said, it may be time to move on to someone that wants your business?

**hunterjwizard** · 09-09-2015, 10:03 PM

XYZ's support isn't unresponsive, it's just useless.

Let me give you an example: my first major printer issue was a weird offset. The printer clearly knew where the heads were when it did its pre-print cleaning, but when it came time to ACTUALLY print it was offset by several inches on the X and Y axis. Being a tech guy myself(my job is diagnosing problems with networking gear) I immediately recognized this as a problem with the array's firmware that could likely be fixed by flashing it and reloading factory defaults. I even proved this when XYZ released a firmware update and the printer worked again for all of about 8 hours.

Da Vinci's techs were powerless to help, and could only offer me an RMA. On top of the money I'd paid for the printer(which at that point had roughly ~100 hours on it) I now had to shell out about $70 to ship it to them for repairs. The printer worked for all of a week when it came back. I then spent another week trying to calibrate it, bought Simplyify 3d, watched all of my problems disappear, then watched them all come crashing back.

At this point, my issues with the unit are almost entirely caused by the Da Vinci's piss-poor calibration method, which involves endless hours of trial and error, lacks any kind of feedback to the controlling PC, and basically requires you to sit there with your thumb up your @$$ the entire time.

I've owned my printer for 10 months. It has spent 7 of those months broken. I would be printing more or less non-stop if I had the machine consistently working for me. As it is I have a project I'd hopped to finish in mid-January that is still not done, delayed constantly by these failures. I basically need the damn thing to work for about another 60 hours, then I can be done for a while...

**hunterjwizard** · 09-10-2015, 12:35 AM

Just had a lovely chat with XYZ's support, I will say they are prompt if unhelpful.

We've now narrowed my problem down to a failure in whatever sensor detects jams. Would be nice if you could just turn it off so I could print, but whatever.

**Guest** · 09-10-2015, 09:58 AM

I'm not a fan of the "send it to us and we'll fix it" solution. Especially on large objects that cost a lot to ship. So the sensor that detects filament movement looks like it is bad? These can usually be removed by disassembling the print head. Do you have a second extruder you are not using? I seem to remember this being a dual extruder model from one of your other posts. Maybe you could swap the sensors to get one working?

If you do disassemble the print head, you might check with XYZ to see if there is a proper reassembly method. I have a CubePro at work, and the way some of these out-of-the-box printers have the extruder designed, you have to use a calibration pin to keep the correct gap distance between the pressure roller and stepper gear while replacing the screws in a specific order. Not doing this could give you all sorts of extrusion issues do to incorrect pressure on the filament.

**hunterjwizard** · 09-10-2015, 05:13 PM

I hate the "send it to us and we'll fix it" method, too, especially since I sent it to them and they didn't fix it!

I did, however, after much cajoling, talk to da-vinci into replacing the entire dual extruder assembly for "Free"(I have to pay shipping

) but they are giving me an upgrade to a better extruder, and they are not making me send back the bad one, so for the bargain price of about $10(I sprung for 2 day express) I'll now have a new extruder. That will make me confident enough to take apart the old one and see about repairing it.

It wouldn't advice the swapping sensors method as it looks like they are soldered onto the PSB, but its entirely possible I can fix the old extruder by dismantling and cleaning it thoroughly. I hesitate on this because, at the end of the day, for me this is a tool that just needs to work - I don't get a whole lot of pleasure out of tinkering with the mechanics, not when what I really want is for the device itself to just print forever and ever and ever....

**Guest** · 09-11-2015, 09:27 AM

Glad they are doing something for you. Fingers crossed that this gives you a permanently working machine.

I didn't know they soldered their sensor to the board. That kind of sucks, but at least you'll be able to work on it as a "spare" now. Keep us updated!

**hunterjwizard** · 09-11-2015, 02:42 PM

Once I have the new extruder in I'll carefully examine the old one and tell you what I find. I'm comfortable screwing around with it if I have a spare, but I didn't want to dismantle and risk bricking my only extruder :P

**hunterjwizard** · 09-16-2015, 09:20 PM

So I'm not arguing in favor of the da vinci's quality or insisting that their CS is any good.

That being said, the replacement part does appear to have fixed my issue. At least the new one isn't jamming. I've not got a lot of positive things to say, the fact that the old extruder failed after less than 300 hours of use is disquieting to say the least. It is entirely possible its fixable, but this is a bit like if the fuel injector on your car failed at 1,000 miles, and the car company expected you to dismantle and repair it yourself with no instructions and nebulous calbriation. You might fix your car, but you'd never buy from them again.

**Guest** · 09-17-2015, 10:21 AM

Fingers crossed that this one lasts longer!

**hunterjwizard** · 09-18-2015, 02:49 AM

Don't wear out your fingers. The new extruder is good(probably) but the failure rate on the da vinci cartridges is about 2 in 3. Thats... well thats not acceptable. Shopping for a new one.

**dbregman** · 09-18-2015, 05:40 AM

I briefly considered DaVinci until I realized that they use proprietary cartridges. There are just too many options out there that use standard filliment.

**hunterjwizard** · 09-18-2015, 12:24 PM

Originally the proprietary cartrdieg seemed like a great idea! Know how much filament you have left? Yes! And if the bloody things had worked 100% of the time I'd probably be keeping my da vinci. But in the end its the failure rate that kills it.

**hunterjwizard** · 09-25-2015, 04:51 PM

So here's where we are on my horror storay: after replacing the extruder didn't work, they offered to do a second RMA(in six weeks). I mentioned I was using Simplify, and they are trying to claim that voids the warranty(that's not how warranties work in the state of California, where I am and where XYZ as it's US offices). I have corrected them on this issue and demanded escalation.

For anyone who is interested, I suggest you file a complaint with the San Diego Better Business Bureu. Myself I am considering a lawsuit. You know, either that or replace the da vinci's mainbioard entirely(which WILL void the warranty, but thats another story).

**hunterjwizard** · 09-25-2015, 05:33 PM

http://www.bbb.org/sdoc/business-rev...o-ca-172010868

XYZ Printing has an F from the better business burea. If you've had issues with them file a complaint of your own, you do not have to be a resident of California or even of the United States - if you own one of these printers and the ****ed you over, this is where you can file a formal complaint.

**Guest** · 09-26-2015, 10:29 AM

Still messing with their support? You have more persistence than I would have at this point. Filing with the BBB is a great suggestion, short of a lawsuit.

**hunterjwizard** · 09-28-2015, 04:17 AM

If I were willing to go to the trouble of taking them to court, I'd win - they sold a defective product and using third-party software doesn't void the warranty. But I am just not willing to go to all that trouble over a $650 item. If the BBB doesn't come back with an answer I'll go with Plan B.

**hunterjwizard** · 10-06-2015, 10:37 PM

"The business has sent a second message regarding this complaint and the BBB has determined that the company's response does not adequately address all the issues or make a good faith effort to resolve the dispute. The contents of this message are below or attached. The BBB has decided to close this complaint and consider it unresolved."

Keep in mind XYZ Printing already has an F- rating from the BBB and is not even officially registered with them. That takes inter-planetary GULFs of f***s not given.

**Guest** · 10-07-2015, 10:04 AM

Well that sucks. Since you finished your SkyShip, I suppose your next project could be replacing the controller on this thing.

**hunterjwizard** · 10-07-2015, 04:34 PM

Yeah probably :P although in a week I'll have my Duplicator 4S so maybe my next "project" will be a coffin for the da vinci!

**Guest** · 10-08-2015, 09:31 AM

Personally, I recommend you put it on a boat, send it out into the Pacific, and light it with a flaming arrow.

**hunterjwizard** · 10-08-2015, 06:21 PM

That might be the most effective way to old-yeller the darn thing.

Anyway I've officially told Da Vinci where they can stick their terrible product. I'm going to spend the next few days putting up reviews on various 3D forums

The take away from all this: Do not buy a Da Vinci. Their product is bad and their support is next to useless.

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True Stories of Tech Support: Just How Bad is XYZ Tech Support?

True Stories of Tech Support: Just How Bad is XYZ Tech Support?

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